Episode 18: Canadian Tuxedo

Two Cents Plus Tax
Episode Eighteen: “Canadian Tuxedo”


Transcript has been lightly edited for readability.

(theme song plays)

K: I’m Krystal.

C: I’m Caitlin.

K: And this is …

K & C: Two Cents Plus Tax!

C: What’s up what’s up? Welcome back.

K: We’re here! We’re doin it.

C: Thank you for joining us on Two Cents Plus Tax!

K: Yeah!

C: Krystal. How are you today?

K: I’m okay! I’m glad it’s the weekend. It seems like, for some reason this week, the weekend kinda snuck up on me.

C: Mm-hmm.

K: I’m just … you know, whatever, every day you wake up and you’re working and doing whatever, and all of the sudden it was Friday, and I was like, (laughs) what? What happened?

C: Yeah.

K: But yeah. I’m really pleased that it’s … it’s the weekend. How bout you?

C: Thank god. Yeah. Yeah, I’m just … grateful it’s Saturday. Toshio, I think, will be joining us in a little bit. He is traveling in the ether right now. AKA I think Virginia. I don’t know.

K: (laughs) Yeah. Virginia is—

C: I think that’s what he said. (laughs) So—

K: —technically the ether. (laughs)

C: (laughs) Yeah.

K: That’s how we define it.

C: So yeah, hopefully he can pop in. But okay, so I am … I’m very excited about this topic.

K: (laughs) You would be.

C: I—it is completely on-brand for me.

K: Mm.

C: And … that’s all I’m going to say. We are going to be talking about ghosts today!

K: (imitating ghost noises) Wooooo!

C: So how excited are you to talk about ghosts? Is this your like … sports?

K: You know it’s not my sports! (laughs)

C: I know! It’s not your thing! (laughs)

K: Yeah. I don’t … you know, I just don’t go in for it. It’s not something—I mean, in the sense that I’m not super—I don’t really care about whether people think there are or are not ghosts—

C: Mm-hmm.

K: I am not really invested in any ghosty-type shows or movies—

C: Mm-hmm.

K: —like it’s just not … it’s similar to how I feel about aliens, where I’m like, if they are extant, then fine; if they’re not, also fine. Like I don’t really—

C: Yeah.

K: —(laughs) I mean, I don’t really care either way.

C: So this is one reason why I thought it would be fun to talk about it with you specifically.

K: Mm.

C: Because you are the Scully; I am the Mulder.

K: (laughs) But I’m not—

C: And I like that!

K: Oh. No, no no.

C: I like it when, you know, you can hear different perspectives on something—

K: Mm-hmm.

C: —that … you know, people are gonna get, I think, a fair and balanced conversation about ghosts. And we did a Twitter poll—very scientific—yesterday. It’s peer-reviewed empirical evidence on people’s—

K: Okay, it’s not. Lemme just say that, as someone who works for journals—academic journals—

C: (laughs)

K: —I just wanna say, it’s absolutely not that, but go ahead.

C: It was peer-reviewed by me.

K: (laughs) No.

C: I checked the results.

K: Mm-hmm. That’s not how it works.

C: And (laughs) … okay, so we just said, hey, you know, do you believe in ghosts?

K: Mm-hmm.

C: Yes? No? Maybe? The majority of people—we got over two million votes.

K: (laughs)

C: The majority of people, almost sixty per cent, said maybe. Possibly.

K: Mm-hmm.

C: Twenty-six per cent of people gave the correct answer, which is yes, obviously they’re real. And then only fifteen per cent said no, absolutely not. They’re not real.

K: Yeah. I wonder, whenever—you know, speaking of ghosts vs. aliens and whatnot—I … this is just a sense that I get, but I feel like people are maybe more likely to believe that ghosts exist than aliens exist—

C: Mm-hmm.

K: Just because I think that we have a much more immediate fascination with what happens after you’re no longer alive, right? Like we—

C: Right.

K: I mean, generally speaking, we as a culture (laughs) have a fascination with that, and so I think more people are probably like, either “I do believe in them” or like, “I don’t know, maybe. Maybe not!” You know? I think people are just like, who’s to say—

C: Mm-hmm.

K: —more than I think they are about aliens. I feel like people are much more—much more likely to be like, no. (laughs) Aliens don’t exist.

C: Right.

K: Because if they did, we would … you know, have been destroyed by now. (laughs) Or something. I don’t know. I feel like just generally speaking, people are more willing to engage with ghosts, as an idea that is real, rather than aliens.

C: Yeah. I mean I think people are more apt to believe in human stuff—

K: Mm-hmm.

C: —versus like, oh, there’s possibilities of, you know, other kinds of existence out there. Even though we know so little. That’s why when people are like, “No, ghosts don’t exist!” or “No, aliens don’t exist!” … to me, I’m just like, are you serious? We know absolutely nothing!

K: This is why I’m just like … yeah, exactly. This is part of the reason why I’m like, I don’t—I don’t … you know. If they are, then fine. If they’re not, then also fine. I feel uncomfortable with being like, definitively no.

C: Right.

K: Especially about aliens, like—

C: Yeah. Like we are just … we aren’t even specks of dust. We’re like specks of dust on top of dust, and—

K: It’s so—

C: —in terms of how huge the universe is, and—

K: Exactly. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah.

C: —what’s out there, and … you know, to be like, “No. Humans are the peak of existence!”—

K: Exactly! It’s so—

C: —“We’ve got it!”

K: —self-centered. It’s very, very narcissistic, about like, nope. Nothing else exists. It’s only us—

C: Right.

K: —and we are at the top of the food chain pyramid, whatever you wanna—

C: Yeah. It’s very foolish.

K: —describe it as. But yeah.

C: So now have you ever had any kind of like … supernatural thing happen to you or anyone in your family?

K: I don’t think so. I mean, when I was younger, so probably like my junior high through freshman year, we lived in a house that my family … not my family like my immediate family, but like my grandma and her siblings owned it, cuz it had belonged to her aunt, and when her aunt passed away, obviously, you know, they—she didn’t have any kids. So it went to my grandma and her siblings, and they owned it. And so we lived in that house for like three years, and I think my grandma’s aunt had passed away there, but I can’t remember, actually. But my grandma was like, “Well, I wouldn’t wanna stay there,” and I’m like (laughs)—

C: (laughs)

K: I think my grandma probably is the person in our family that believes most. And it’s not really like an explicit she’s ever said ghosts are real, or whatever—

C: Mm-hmm.

K: —but I think she just—there’s a … an anxiousness surrounding that kind of thing. But yeah, she was always like, “Well, I wouldn’t wanna live in that house.” But we lived there for three years, and it was fine. Like I never—

C: Right.

K: Nothing (laughs) weird ever happened.

C: Yeah.

K: It was perfectly okay. But I personally have never had an experience; I don’t think my mom or sister have either. But I would be interested to ask my grandma to see if she actually feels like there has ever been something that, you know, she couldn’t explain. But yeah. No, personally, no. Which, you know, I don’t know. Again, I’m just like … if it had—there was something spooky, I probably would never have attributed it to that—

C: Mm-hmm.

K: —anyway, so. (laughs) Maybe it’s lost on me—

C: So you’re someone—I’m sorry. I have to say, I get so excited when I’m talking with you—

K: (laughs)

C: —that it’s like, I cannot hold in my words, and there’s just somethin about … when we’re talking, I’m just like, “Oh my god I’m so excited!”—

K: (laughs)

C: —and I have no self-control, and I start talkin over you, so I’m sorry. (laughs)

K: That’s okay. It’s weird, but it’s okay. (laughing) It’s fine.

C: It is weird. I’m like that with certain people. Anyway, I am—I’m the opposite, where I’m like, immediately—I attribute everything to the supernatural.

K: (laughs)

C: Like immediately. to the point where I’m like … even I’m like, “Okay. Tone it down a bit.”

K: (laughs)

C: But, you know, I haven’t had, I would say, a lot of intense—where I’m like, this is a ghost. Although I have had weird stuff happen where I’m like, this is curious.

K: Mm-hmm.

C: And, you know, I am certainly just … I mean, it goes beyond believer. I’m like, yes. This is absolutely real. I know a lot of people who have experienced very weird stuff, have—you know, they see things; they hear things that just can’t be explained. And to me, I’m like, I believe that … I guess I would frame it in terms of energy. And this goes back to the first law of thermodynamics.

K: (laughs) Okay.

C: Which is, you know, energy can’t be created or destroyed, only altered in its form. So to me, I do believe in energy imprints, and that everything has an energy to it.

K: Mm-hmm.

C: And that there can be kind of like an echo of energy happening. Which could translate into spirit activity. I also think that … you know, there’s all these kinds of different forms of energy. So you can talk about like … a human—like a human spirit. Or something else that isn’t human. Like all different kinds of entities that are not people.

K: Wait, what do you mean? Like … not animals. You mean like—

C: I mean like things not of this world.

K: Mm-hmm. (laughs) Okay. Alright.

C: Yeah. So … yeah, not human entities.

K: Mm-hmm.

C: And this sounds like I’m very biblical. I am not. (laughs)

K: Yeah. Like—

C: This is not like, you know—

K: —so you mean like demons and stuff, basically. Is that—

C: Well … I mean, kind of.

K: (laughs)

C: I just think there is so much out there, and I think it’s really fascinating from like an anthropological standpoint. When you look at all these different cultures—

K: Mm.

C: —and how they conceptualize what we would call ghosts or spirits or whatever, and how there’s a lot of times these common themes—we have different names for them—

K: Mm-hmm.

C: —but these kinds of different themes or patterns of spiritual stuff that they see. But we call them different things. Shapeshifters, you know, that’s a lot in Native American mythology.

K: Mm-hmm.

C: Like that’s one reason when we were talking about Trickster the other week—

K: Right.

C: —I was like, oh, this is really cool for me. And one of my friends, who grew up on a reservation—and I wish I could remember the name of it, but this is in Oklahoma. There was a specific name that they would talk about. And it sounds like “skittle,” but that is not the word.

K: (laughs)

C: But they would talk about these … these spirits that would shapeshift, and they’re like, yeah, do not go in the woods.

K: Mm-hmm.

C: Like, don’t do that. Cuz that’s where these—it wasn’t like “skillet”—god, I wish I could remember. But—

K: (laughs)

C: And you see that a lot, and then in regards to the energy thing … so (sighs) I was thinking about my experiences, and the house that I really grew up in, I think about it and like immediately I just feel dread and anxiety with it.

K: (laughs) Mm-hmm.

C: And part of that is … you know, what was going on in my life and my family. Obviously, like I’m not gonna discount that. That is … a part of it, for sure.

K: Right.

C: It was not a good time, and of course the house can be very symbolic, and blah blah. Okay.

K: Mm-hmm.

C: That said, That said, the house itself had a very dark and heavy energy to it.

K: Yeah.

C: Come to find out (laughs) the bricks that were used to build the house had been part of the bricks that had been made to build the state asylum. Like years and years and years before.

K: Whoa.

C: Not cool, dude. Not cool. Because you think about what asylums … or, you know. I guess we don’t call them asylums anymore. (sighs) Psychiatric hospitals, whatever.

K: Right. Right.

C: You think about how people are treated there now? Still not good. You think about how they were treated … seventy, eighty—

K: (laughing) Oh, man.

C: —I mean, and then—so that’s how I’m thinking. I do think things absorb energy, and it is carried into them.

K: Have you—

C: So that’s just my personal belief.

K: Have you seen the movie Session 9?

C: Session 9.

K: Yeah. It’s—

C: What is that?

K: It’s with David Caruso and a bunch of other people where you’re like, I don’t—

C: That is a flashback. David Caruso!

K: I know. Oh, Josh Lucas is in it too. I guess that’s someone people might recognize. But basically, it’s about this group of people who take this job cleaning up an abandoned mental hospital.

C: Mm-hmm.

K: And like stuff starts to happen, and … it sort of reminded me of it—I was reminded of it because when you mentioned like okay, the bricks for this place were used for this place, and it led to, you know—or, you know, you felt like maybe there was some connection between—

C: Mm-hmm.

K: —potentially the spirits from the other place and this place. It’s kind of a similar thing, where these are just guys who are living their life and then they go to this place and stuff starts to happen, and they feel like they’re bringing that energy from, you know, that abandoned hospital with them into their lives, and it’s affecting them and whatever. It’s a very scary movie. (laughs)

C: Is it? Okay.

K: As somebody who doesn’t like scary movies, it’s—

C: Yeah.

K: —I think you might be interested in it, both for the scary movie aspect and the (sniffs) … you know, the spirit energy, you know, ghosty aspect of it.

C: Yeah.

K: Yeah. Recommend it.

C: That sounds like my thing.

K: It’s a very old movie. It came out in like 2001. I’m surprised you haven’t heard of it.

C: Session 9.

K: Mm-hmm.

C: Hmm. I don’t know it.

K: Yeah. I mean, you can tell it came out in 2001, if (laughs) David Caruso is like—

C: Right. Whatever happened to him?

K: I think he was like not that good to work with, maybe?

C: Okay.

K: But it’s like the stuff of … maybe you’ve read about him. And I think after … you know, he was on NYPD Blue and thought he was like hot shit, you know?

C: Mm-hmm.

K: And then was like, “I’m leaving NYPD Blue cuz I’m gonna be in movies!”—

C: Right.

K: —and then his movies were like, (laughing) not good.

C: Yeah. He went nowhere.

K: (laughing) They were all like Session 9. So he was like, “Okay, I’m going back to TV,” and then he did CSI: Miami for like a million years.

C: Oh, right!

K: Yeah. I don’t—is that—that show’s not still on. I don’t know.

C: I don’t think so.

K: They have like a lot of CSIs, so (laughing) I don’t know which one is the one that’s active right now.

C: I have no idea either. Are there any good movies or TV shows about ghosts that you’ve seen?

K: I mean, obvious—the obvious one. The one actually—

C: Ghost Dad. (laughs)

K: ​​(laughs) Yes. You know. Ghost Dad—is Bill Cosby in that movie?

C: Yes.

K: Okay. Anyways.

C: Moving along.

K: Yeah. No, I mean the obvious one that I thought of was Ghost.

C: Yes. Yes.

K: The movie Ghost.

C: Ditto.

K: The one everyone loves. I don’t know why, but I feel like that movie just … (sighs) there are a couple movies where I feel like I can’t recall the first time I ever saw them, and they just (laughs) always existed in my mind. Like I always knew what they were about; I had always—you know. And that was one of them for me.

C: Mm-hmm.

K: For some reason, it was a big … it’s a big movie in my family. To the point where my grandpa, who does not like that kind of movie at all—his type of movie is like, Blazing Saddles—

C: Yeah. (laughs)

K: —or, you know, something like that, like some other kind of western comedy or western plus a comedy (laughs) … that’s more his jam. But for some reason he really liked Ghost.

C: Really? (laughs)

K: Like a lot. (laughing) And so I don’t know, I just watched that movie all the time as a kid, and it’s a really good movie. I don’t know if people have watched it recently. It was on TV a couple months ago, and I was like, oh, I haven’t seen this movie in forever, lemme check in on it. It’s still very, very good.

C: I have not seen that in so long.

K: Man, it’s one of those movies where you remember just why Patrick Swayze was such a huge phenomenon.

C: Mm-hmm.

K: He’s so incredible in that movie. Also Whoopi Goldberg just like …

C: Yeah.

K: … knockin it outta the park in that movie. Unfortunately, I don’t feel like Demi Moore has like a lot to do aside from be vaguely sad and like … wear a lot of linen. (laughs)

C: Yeah. (laughs)

K: Like she’s not asked to do a lot. She has a very weird haircut in that movie, too. And Tony … Tony Goldwyn, from—

C: Who?

K: —from Scandal, who played the president on Scandal—Fitz on Scandal—he’s like the best friend in that movie.

C: Oh, yeah! The bad guy!

K: Yes, exactly. And the effects in the movie—I’m gonna say, it’s from 1990.

C: Mm-hmm.

K: So, you know. You know what you’re getting into when you go into it.

C: Mm-hmm.

K: But the effects are really bad and cheesy. But like the movie itself I think really holds up in terms of the themes and the performances … it’s just—it’s really good. It’s a really good movie. But yeah, that’s the one that came to mind when I was like, oh yeah! Remember that was a huge phenomenon—

C: Right.

K: —and Whoopi Goldberg won an Oscar? Like … that was a time.

C: And all the parodies?

K: Yes. It’s been, like … yes. “Unchained Melody,” like you … there’s so many movies that have parodied the sort of clay pottery scene. It’s kind of a joke now, but—

C: Yeah.

K: In the movie … in the context of the movie, it really works. Like you really do feel like … you get the sort of strength of their relationship, but you also sort of feel really bad, cuz it’s like, he didn’t appreciate it when he was alive, and now he’s dead, and like … oh yeah. I should probably have treated her better when I was living. But yeah, it’s a good movie, and I highly recommend checking in on it if you haven’t. At least to me, I think it holds up.

C: Alright! Yeah. It’s been—

K: What about you?

C: It’s been—I mean … well, it’s been forever since I’ve actually seen Ghost.

K: Watch it!

C: What are some other ghosty movies?

K: Yeah, I’m tr[ying]—I mean—

C: There’s that one with Nicole Kidman about the ghost kids.

K: Ooh! Okay, so that movie—every time I think of it—it’s called The Others, if you guys gon’t remember—

C: The Others! Right.

K: That movie, to me, very specifically puts me in a—a very … so it came out in 2002.

C: Really?!

K: And—yes. And I know this because I started college in 2001, and I remember coming home for like … I think it was … well, did it come out in 2002 or 2001? Lemme look it up.

C: God, it’s been so long.

K: Oh, no it came out in 2001.

C: Okay.

K: It came out in 2001. And I remember that like … my sister, when I came home for Christmas, like the first Christmas of my freshman year of college, I remember my sister was like, “You have to watch this movie!”

C: (laughs)

K: Like, “It is wild!” And I’m like, “Uhh, okay.” So we watched it and … I don’t wanna give it away. You kind of already gave it away (laughs) by saying ghost kids.

C: I mean, it is twenty years. It’s a twenty-year-old movie.

K: But yeah, it’s—

C: I feel like, don’t come for us.

K: That’s fair.

C: It’s been out a long time. You’ve had time to go see it.

K: That’s fair. Yeah, it’s—

C: It’s ghost kids.

K: Well, I mean it’s ghosts—it’s a lotta ghosts—people are ghosts, basically.

C: Yeah.

K: So it’s a movie—Nicole Kidman is a woman—it’s set in England in like World War I, and she has two kids, and her husband is off—

C: Somewhere.

K: —in a war, fighting, and her kids have some kind of condition where they can’t see the sun or be in the sun, and—

C: Or leave the house. Like they have to—

K: Or leave the house, yeah.

C: —stay inside, right?

K: Basically they pretty much all just stay on their property—

C: Yeah.

K: —like the entire time, and it’s very unclear as to what is going on, and then you get to the end of the movie and you find out what is going on (laughs). But yeah, it’s kinda—

C: Is she a ghost?

K: I mean—

C: I can’t remember!

K: —I feel really bad spoiling it. If you don’t wanna know the end of the movie, fast forward … whatever, two minutes. But so basically we find out that the reason that they can’t leave the property is because they’re all dead. Because when her husband left for war, she kind of … you know, it really affected her mentally, and so she ended up … I think she found out that her husband left for war and that he was killed. And, you know, obviously she couldn’t—it sort of caused a break, and she ended up killing herself and her children, and I believe the servants as well—

C: Mm.

K: —who lived there? And so you see all of the people—and so in the course of the movie, when it starts out, you’re like, they think that someone is haunting them.

C: Right.

K: And then you find out that, no, no; they are the ghosts in the house, and there’s a new family there, and they are basically causing like … wreaking havoc on that new family, who’s actually alive.

C: Right. Okay.

K: So yeah. It’s a good movie. It’s kinda … it’s in that like, post-M. Night Shyamalan era—which, I mean, is another ghosty movie we could talk about.

C: Oh, right. Sixth Sense.

K: Sixth Sense. It’s like post-Sixth Sense, so there were a lot—there was a huge slew of movies that came out that were kind of like, ooh, we have to have a twist—

C: Right. (laughs)

K: —and it has to be like, horror, or thriller in the twist, and it’s like, well every movie’s not gonna be that, because now people are sort of, you know, primed to expect something like that. But yeah, it’s pretty good. But that’s another one that I think of when I think of like ghosty movies, and it very, very specifically reminds me of my sister whenever I think about it—

C: Yeah.

K: —cuz she was like, “You have to watch it! It’s so good!” I’m like, “Uh, okay!”

C: I do remember that being a good movie.

K: It’s not bad! It’s a pretty good movie. It’s back in the era where I still was interested in what Nicole Kidman might do. (laughs)

C: Mm-hmm.

K: Now I’m like, eh, I don’t really care that much.

C: Yeah. Fair.

K: But yeah. it’s a pretty good movie. And she doesn’t really do movies like that. Like she’s not really a horror or thriller person.

C: Nuh-uh.

K: So it was kind of surprising that she was even in that movie to begin with. But it was a good movie, I think.

C: Yeah! I’m glad you brought up M. Night.

K: (laughs)

C: Because I just like, yeah. Sixth Sense? That was …

K: So good.

C: … everywhere.

K: Yeah.

C: And—

K: Did you see it in the theatre?

C: No. I saw it … I—so the twist was spoiled for me—

K: That’s a bummer!

C: —by … I was watchin The Daily Show—

K: (laughs)

C: —and this is back in, whatever, like—

K: Yeah, when you would do that? Yeah.

C: —1998 or something?

K: When someone would watch The Daily Show?

C: Yeah! And it was—I can’t remember. His name was Frank something, and they had some segment and he spoils it! And he was like, “Bruce Willis is dead!”

K: Oh my god! (laughs)

C: So I—yeah. So I knew watching it—

K: Aw.

C: —that he was the ghost. Although it was still like, I remember being like, oh, this is scary. So I still enjoyed it, but it was like, oh, I woulda liked it better if I hadn’t known.

K: That’s a huge bummer, yeah. I remember going with my friend Emily and my friend Victoria, and Emily had already seen it. So she knew. But she—she did a really good job of not … not spoiling it, but also not sort of giving us hints as to what to expect. Like we just went—Victoria and I just went into it totally cold, and were like—

C: Mm-hmm.

K: It was so good. Especially in the theater with a bunch of other people? You’re just like, oh my god! Like (laughs) everyone’s freaking out. It was amazing. It was one of those movies where you … you watch it, and it has like this twist or this ending, and then you immediately are like, I have to see that again. Like I have to go back and see all the things that I missed and didn’t pick up on, and—

C: Mm-hmm.

K: But actually, I re-watched that movie probably a couple of years ago, after not having seen it probably since like, I don’t know, 200 … 2002 or somethin? And … I remember people being like, oh, it’s a horror movie, it’s a horror movie. And there are parts of it that are scary, but ultimately, it’s kind of a psychological drama about this kid trying to … like he’s in such a sad place, cuz he’s being terrorized by all these ghosts who want help from him, but also, he’s so scared to tell his mother the truth of what’s happening cuz they already have a difficult life cuz their dad left them, and like … there’s all this other like family drama (laughs) that’s happening surrounding the supernatural kind of drama, and I’m like, this movie’s really deep. I’m kind of annoyed that people were like, oh, it’s a horror movie, and I’m like, it is, but it’s also about both Bruce Willis trying to repair his relationship with his wife, and, you know, Haley Joel Osment trying to not send his mom flying off the edge, cuz she’s (laughing) barely holding on or whatever. I don’t know, it’s just—it’s a really touching movie. Like Toni Collette is incredible in that movie.

C: She’s good in everything!

K: She’s so good in it!

C: Toni Collette is good in everything.

K: Ugh! It’s amazing. Yeah.

C: I love, love Toni Collette. I have to say—you know, for the zillionth time—I don’t remember the movie. But—

K: (laughs)

C: Nate Bargatze?

K: Mm-hmm. Comedian.

C: The comedian? He has a really funny bit about The Sixth Sense and how it’s basically like—

K: (clears throat)

C: —Bruce Willis is like, “Yeah, I haven’t talked to my wife in a year,” and it like … nobody’s alarm bells rang. They’re just like—

K: Yeah, exactly!

C: —oh, that’s heterosexual married life!

K: (laughs)

C: (laughing) Where they’re like, “Ohh!” … they’re like, “Yeah, he”—I don’t know.

K: (laughs) Ah, yeah. That’s what I mean about the movie, like you were watching it and you’re thinking it’s about this guy trying to repair his relationship with his wife, right? Like he’s … they’re distant. There’s a distance there, and you’re like, I don’t understand what’s going on, and then you have the … you know, Haley Joel Osment and his mom, and they’re poor, but she sends him to private school cuz it matters to her, and there’s like all this stuff that she’s working out. (laughs) You know. It’s just—I don’t know. It’s just a very … (clears throat) … there’s a lot more going on than just oh, it’s a movie about ghosts. Like it’s—

C: Yeah.

K: —it’s more than that. But yeah, that was a huge phenomenon also.

C: Mm-hmm.

K: The whole “I see dead people” was another thing that became like—

C: (laughs) Right! Ugh.

K: It became a meme before we called everything memes. (laughs)

C: Right.

K: Like it was everywhere. Yeah.

C: The only thing I—the only other movie I can think of that kind of went along with that in terms of cultural impact from when we were … when we were comin up—

K: Mm-hmm.

C: Was [The] Blair Witch [Project].

K: (laughs) Oh, yes, of course. Mm-hmm.

C: Yeah. And I saw that in the theater.

K: I did not.

C: You know … (sighs) that’s another one where it’s like, you watch it and it’s very dated.

K: Mm-hmm.

C: Which is not bad; I mean, it’s kind of to be expected, but at the time, it was … huge.

K: Yeah. I mean, I don’t think you—I don’t think that movie … I mean, I think it makes sense, because a lot of the focus of that movie is about the technology that they’re using to try to like—

C: Mm-hmm.

K: —so of course it’s gonna be, you know, dated. Technology’s always changing, and, you know, being innovated on, and so of course it’s gonna feel like, (laughs) oh wow, I can’t believe this is how they were (laughs) going about all of this stuff.

C: Right.

K: But yeah, that to me is one of the ones that was a little bit too scary for me (laughs), where I was like, hmm … no.

C: Yeah. I agree. There are things about that too—like, for me, one of the scariest things you can do is to be alone in the woods.

K: Mm-hmm.

C: In the dark; there is no one there. And then one of the scariest things about that movie is when you hear a baby crying in the woods. It’s pitch-black.

K: (laughs)

C: I’m like, is there anything scarier than a ghost baby?

K: (laughs) Yeah. I mean—

C: I mean it! Like is there anything scarier than a ghost baby? I don’t think so.

K: Very few things. Very few things. I mean, probably … yeah, I think it’s because of the like … the human sort of—the immediate human reaction to a baby crying. You’re like, oh no! A baby! But then you’re like … what the fuck? There’s no baby! You know what I mean?

C: Right.

K: (laughing) Like, we’re in the middle of the woods!

C: Right.

K: It’s nighttime! There’s no babies! Like, what else could be making that sound? Like that’s very—

C: Ughhhhh.

K: —terrifying. Yeah. I don’t … that movie just—it was too much for me. But it also, you know, spawned a lot of memes and like—

C: Oh my god.

K: —sketches on comedy shows and stuff.

C: Yeah.

K: It was a huge deal.

C: Mm-hmm.

K: Yeah. I don’t know. There was that—that period was like a big period for those kinds of movies, and then they kind of went away. They’re back now, but—

C: But then they came back! Yeah.

K: Yeah.

C: Because then there were all those movies that came out that … and they all looked the same and it’s all like, you know, home footage. Like Paranormal Activity, and—

K: Yeah! Paranormal Activity. Yeah. Jinx.

C: Yeah.

K & C: (laugh)

K: No, yeah. Those—they’re back again, and it’s—I was never in on the whole trend the first time, so the second time, I was like, nah, this is not for me.

C: Mm-hmm.

K: I’m not gonna see these movies. Especially cuz I just don’t like … the thing about scary movies that I don’t like—I’m really bad with gore and stuff, like that is too much.

C: Mm-hmm. Yeah, I don’t enjoy that.

K: If something’s too bloody, I’m just like, nope. But also, I don’t—I don’t like jump scares. Like I really hate them. (laughs) And I think if a movie has a certain number of them, like below a certain number, I feel like I can handle it. I feel like Sixth Sense was like the perfect amount. I was like, that—if there were any more in that movie, I probably would have been over it. But—and also too if the, you know, actual emotional drama of that movie was lessened, I probably wouldn’t have been as into it. But yeah, I just don’t like that feeling (laughs) of being—

C: Mm-hmm.

K: —spooked in that way. It’s too … it’s too much for me. I can’t handle it.

C: Yeah. I am someone … and this is probably the PTSD, but I have like the hypervigilance.

K: Mm.

C: And when I watch a scary movie … literally … I would say I’m—if you wanna watch a scary movie, I’m a good person to watch it with you. I will be—I will get scared and like, the problem is like (laughs), if I’m in the theater or something, I will be the only person in the entire theater who is making noise from being scared. That happened in Get Out.

K: (laughs)

C: I went to see Get Out—oh my god, in the theater. And people were laughing at me cuz I was like (theatrical gasp).

K: (laughs)

C: (laughing) I just can’t help it! And then I will say this. After Get Out—Get Out was so scary to me. I saw it with … so obviously, I’m white. I saw it with another white woman.

K: (laughs) Obviously.

C: We’re driving home. We see this white woman power walking on the sidewalk. We both got so scared.

K: (laughs) You’re like, I’m terrified of every white person now.

C: We were in the car—no, we were (laughs)—literally I’m like, this movie, as a white woman, made me scared of other white women.

K: I mean—

C: Like this woman was power walking on the street and we both were just like, oh my god! Let’s get outta here!

K: Nope. Something bad is happening, yeah. (laughs) Yeah, no. I mean, honestly we should all be kind of scared of white women. They’re terrifying.

C: We—no, absolutely. Absolutely.

K: (laughs)

C: But that movie literally—it took it to a whole other level for me.

K: Good. I’m glad. I’m glad it did that for people, honestly. (laughs)

C: Yeah!

K: It should. (laughs)

C: Jordan Peele—you know, you’ve done your job.

K: Exactly.

C: And he has a new movie coming out called Nope.

K: Okay, so I was seeing that. Did the actual trailer come out, or was it just like they announced the like—I saw—

C: I think they just announced it.

K: Oh okay, cool.

C: Cuz I haven’t seen anything about the trailer—

K: Yeah, I haven’t either.

C: —cuz I would definitely have watched it.

K: Yeah, I wanted to see it too, because I’m like, oh, the cast looks really good. I would love to see the trailer. But I guess it was just the announcement and the poster and stuff, the photo—

C: Yeah. It’s like Keke Palmer, and who else is in it?

K: Steven Yeun is in it.

C: Who is it?

K: Steven Yeun.

C: (gasps) Oh right!

K: Yeah. It’s like a big—

C: And then there was somebody else. I just—

K: Yep.

C: —forgot, of course.

K: Yeah. It’s—

C: But I don’t know anything about it.

K: Yeah, I thought it came out too, but then I guess it didn’t. I guess it was just the … just the announcement and the poster—sort of images—have come out. And the cast.

C: Yeah.

K: So it’s kind of cool. I don’t know. Again, I (laughs)—I did not see Get Out in the theater, cuz everyone was like, it’s scary! And then I was like oh, it’s like scary because if you’re Black, it’s scary. (laughs) You know what I mean? Like you’re—there are parts of it that are obviously like, violent and stuff, but like it … I watched it on video—you know—

C: Mm-hmm.

K: —or on demand or whatever. I rented it when it had come out—available—and I was like, oh okay, yeah, this scary, but it’s not like—to me, it’s scary in the same way The Sixth Sense is scary, where it’s more like the ideas are scary, you know?

C: Mm-hmm.

K: And not so much like, oh there’s a lot of violent stuff happening that’s gross or creepy … I mean, (laughs) it’s definitely creepy. That’s (laughs) not—


K: That is accurate. But yeah, it’s scary in a different way. It’s more of an existential kind of fear than a like, oh, I’m terrified kind of—because of, you know, violence that’s gonna happen or whatever. (clears throat) But yeah. That is out, and I would be interested to hear more of what it’s about before I go see it, but—

C: Yeah! I don’t know anything about it.

K: I probably am gonna—

C: It’s just from the mind of Jordan Peele.

K: I’m gonna rent it. (laughs)

C: That’s all I saw.

K: Yeah. (laughs) Definitely not gonna be watching it in the theater.

C: (laughs) I know.

K: Sorry, Jordan Peele and Steven Yeun, I like you both, but no thank you. Yeah, I did not see Us in the theater either, so I just—

C: I saw that at home.

K: Yeah. (laughs) That’s how I have to do—my (laughs)—so I’ve talked about this before about scary movies, but like … any kinda ghosty movie or anything like that … like when I find out that it’s out, and—I just go to Wikipedia and read the synopsis—

C: (laughs) Right.

K: Cuz I’m just like, I need to know what is actually going to happen in this movie. So I did that with Old yesterday, when it had come out—the new M. Night Shyamalan movie—

C: What is that about? I don’t know anything about it.

K: So it’s about—apparently people go to this—they’re on vacation, and they go to this island, or this beach, and apparently they can’t get off of it for some reason, and also while they’re there, they start to rapidly age. And so they don’t understand what’s happening or why, or why they can’t escape, and … yeah. So I read the synopsis of that last night, and I was like, oh! Because it’s based on a graphic novel, and from my understanding, in the graphic novel, you don’t really ever find out why, like what was happening or why. But obviously because it’s M. Night Shyamalan, you’re kind of expecting some, you know, reveal or something or twist at the end, so I was like, I need to know what he’s gonna do with this movie. So I went and I read it last night, and I was like, oh! Okay. I see.

C: Who’s in it?

K: It’s like … it’s a very international cast, which is not usually how he does his movies. But it’s like Gael Garcia Bernal and Rufus Sewell and … I forget who else. Some other people.

C: Mm-hmm.

K: The lady from Phantom Thread. I can’t remember her name. She’s not americ[an]—she’s like a European person.

C: Mkay.

K: But yeah. There’s a lotta people who are in it who I’m like, I don’t—I know their faces, but I’m like (laughs), I don’t know who they are because they’re European actors that are in a lot of things I have not seen.

C: Yeah.

K: But yeah. That just came out yesterday and I’m like, well, when it’s available to rent, (laughing) I will possibly rent it, but probably not (laughs), because I’m too spooky. I get too spooked too easily.

C: Yeah. I remember watching scary movies at way too early an age.

K: Mm.

C: Like my sister and I would watch this movie—that was a Disney movie—and it had Bette Davis in it. It’s from 1980. It’s The Watcher in the Woods.

K: Okay.

C: And it terrified me as a kid.

K: (laughs)

C: And … it’s super cheesy. Like super cheesy. But watching that, and then I watched … I feel like I was raised by TV, and I was watching—

K: I mean, we all were.

C: Yeah. I watched a lot of things that I should not have watched, like Twin Peaks when it came out, and I’m like nine years old or whatever.

K: Oh yeah! We never had—so that’s a thing that I find really jarring, especially for parents who are my age who are like—

C: Mm-hmm.

K: —very carefully curating what their kids can watch and won’t watch—can’t watch—and I’m just like, nobody ever—(laughs) like we watched whatever—I watched whatever I wanted—

C: Yeah.

K: —from the time I was born. Like no one ever was like, this is inappropriate for you! We were watching, you know, The Color Purple when we were like five. You know?

C: (laughs)

K: My aunt was like, oh yeah, you’ll like this movie. Let’s watch it! And it was like, The Fly. I’m like, (laughing) what are you doing?!

C: Yeah.

K: I’m seven years old, you know?

C: Right.

K: But yeah, we never had any kinds of restrictions on like stuff—I remember (sighs) I think about this all the time, but when I was like ten, i’m like, okay, I’m getting older. I’m gonna pick a show that’s just for me, that’s just, you know, something I like and I’m not watching it cuz my mom is into it or whatever. And I picked E.R.?

C: At ten?!

K: (laughs) I don’t know why I did that. Yes! (laughs) And I was like, when this show premieres, I’m gonna watch it, and I’m gonna—you know, this is gonna be my grown-up show.

C: Right.

K: I mean, I picked a good show, obviously. But like, yeah, that shows you, no one was caring (laughs)—

C: Right.

K: —what I was watching at that age. And I watched it until it was off the air like twelve years later or whatever. But yeah, like … me neither. I never had any kind of—

C: Right.

K: No one was being like, this is too scary for you—

C: Mm-hmm.

K: —or this is inappropriate or whatever. I’m just like—

C: Yeah.

K: —it’s fine. And I kind of—I don’t know, I’m kind of that way still. Like I think that people are a little too … I don’t know. I think people get a little too caught up in those kinds of things. I think if you’re doing your part parenting in other ways, that kind of stuff really isn’t gonna have an effect on your kid. I mean, unless they’re … you know—

C: Mm.

K: —very tend—they tend to be afraid of things, then yes. But I think in terms of like, oh this is too … I don’t know. I just think people get worried about the wrong stuff, (laughs) kind of. But that’s a—

C: I don’t know. I saw—Twin Peaks was not appropriate for me to be watching, because—

K: I mean, Twin Peaks is like—

C: —there was some very—there’s things that were in that show, honestly, that like … scarred me.

K: But it was on basic cable—it was on like broadcast TV. So there wasn’t—to me, the thing about Twin Peaks is just that like, how do you explain it to a kid, because it’s difficult for adults to understand. (laughs) Like, for me—

C: Yeah. It’s true. (laughs)

K: —it’s like, what do you even, how do you even tell a kid what happened on that episode of Twin Peaks? You’re like, uhh.

C: Yeah, I don’t know. I don’t know now.

K: Yeah. I don’t know either. (laughs) That to me would be the more—more the issue with Twin Peaks. I know there’s like, scary characters, but they’re not—I don’t know—

C: Yeah, there are demons who are like taking the—I mean … honestly, it—stuff that was way inappropriate. Like—

K: I mean, to be—

C: —there is a character on there that was a demon named Bob—

K: Oh, I know—yeah.

C: —who I am still scared about.

K: But to me, the thing—I’m like, okay, people are like, don’t watch this, but then they’ll let their kids watch like Game of Thrones. I’m like (laughs), what?

C: Oh my god! What?

K: That’s … equally as bad. Like to me. Oh, I know a lot of kids who are like tweens and stuff who are like, yeah, really into Game of Thrones.

C: Oh, no. That’s (laughs)—yeah, I’m like, oh god.

K: Yeah. See, but they’ll totally like … you know, gatekeep other things, but Game of Thrones is like okay somehow?

C: Somehow okay? Mm.

K: —and I’m like, what—what that doesn’t make any sense. But yeah, I—yeah. We did not have any rules about what we could watch, so we watched a lot of (laughing) stuff that was inappropriate for kids when I was a kid.

C: (laughs) Right.

K: But yeah. In terms of ghosty stuff, we didn’t really—that wasn’t really my or my sister’s jam that much. I mean, the only other show that I can think of that was even ghost-related was like Ghostwriter. Did you watch that as a kid?

C: Yeah! I don’t remember anything about it, but I do remember vaguely something about it.

K: It was on PBS. Yeah. It was like a … again, we did not have cable, so we watched a lot of PBS, cuz it was like the only other place for kids’ programming when Saturday morning cartoons were happening, or, you know, weekday afternoon cartoons weren’t happening. And Ghostwriter was basically a show—an educational show, obviously. It’s on PBS. So it was like, teaching kids about … stuff? I don’t re[member]—I guess history? Because the whole thing was like, there was a ghost, and it would write and … okay, the premise of the show … it’s wild. When I first realized that this is what it was trying to do, I was like, what? (laughs) So basically it’s the ghost of a runaway slave that has like inhabited—

C: A typewriter or something?

K: Yes. I am not making this up. This is really what it was about.

C: Cuz I watched it too.

K: Yeah. Yeah. And like the … there’s some kids that like find it and then they kinda make (laughs) … they make friends with the ghost (laughing) in the typewriter.

C: Oh, god.

K: It does not make any—so they solve crimes. Basically.

C: There’s so much going on.

K: Yeah. And so—

C: With this premise.

K: (laughs)

C: They’ve got a runaway slave. You’ve got kids. You’ve got a haunted typewriter, and you’ve got solving crimes.

K: (laughs) It’s wild when you think about like, they were —somebody was like, no. This is how we’ll get em. This is how we’ll get the kids. It’s like, what are you talking about? This does not make any sense. Yeah, it’s—it’s just a really weird—

C: Wow.

K: Yeah. But we watched a lot of that as a kid. As kids, me and my sister—

C: Yeah.

K: —cuz like, again, there’s not any—there was (laughs)—there was nothing pandering to us at this time because we did not have cable, and broadcast TV—I don’t even think broadcast TV at all now shows anything for kids, almost ever. Cuz there’s just all this other dedicated programming that people can tap into, so I don’t even know if like … do (laughs) Saturday morning cartoons exist anymore? Cuz—

C: I don’t know.

K: —I don’t know if you used to watch this, but like, you know, that block between 3 and 5, that used to be cartoon time also on TV.

C: Mm.

K: And now, I don’t know what—honestly, I don’t watch broadcast TV (laughs)—

C: Yeah. Me neither.

K: —so I don’t know, but yeah. It was very much like … there was only so much that we could consume at the time.

C: Right. (laughs) Any—any other ghosty things?

K: So I mean, you—so I was wondering, do you watch, or have you watched any of the Ghost Hunter-y type shows that exist and are on and stuff?

C: (sighs) I’m sure I have. I mean, it’s funny because I … was watching this—this is not Ghost Hunter-y, but this girl Brittany Broski—have you heard of her?

K: Nuh-uh.

C: She’s like a younger person. (laughs) I sound so old. She—

K: What do you mean, like a Gen Z-er? Gen Z person?

C: She would be in her twenties. I don’t—is that a Gen Z now?

K: Yes. (laughs)

C: So she did the—she has a meme of her face. I know you would recognize her face because she’s in one of the most popular memes, where it’s like her face twice and like one face, she’s like, well maybe I’ll do this, and then the other one is like, eh—

K: Oh, is it when she’s tasting the kombucha? That one?

C: Yeah!

K: Yeah. Mm-hmm.

C: Okay. So I know her through Trixie and Katya.

K: Mm-hmm.

C: I’m so old.

K: (laughs)

C: But I think she is big on TikTok. I don’t know, I think she does makeup tutorials and like is big on the social media whatever.

K: Mm. Mm-hmm.

C: So she’s … she’s a younger person. But I was watching this interview she did with her mother, who is a paranormal investigator in Texas. And her mom is part of this group, and the … I think the website is like, Ghosthunter Gals or something. And—

K: (laughs) Cute.

C: —just somethin really cute. But her mom was talkin about being an investigator and doing these paranormal investigations and like, then there’s another one where she’s talkin about—and this is stuff where you will roll your eyes, cuz it’s like—

K: (laughs)

C: —you know, fairies, and—

K: (grumbles)

C: —these other like … elves, and like—or gnomes, and stuff that’s way out there. I haven’t really watched a lot of ghost investigator stuff.

K: Mm.

C: One thing I love is this podcast called Spooked.

K: Mm-hmm.

C: And it’s all paranormal stories from regular people. The host is Glynn something, who is so extra. I really can’t handle Glynn. Like, no disrespect, but I’m just like, Glynn will—

K: Is it like Glynn Washington? The same host from Snap Judgment?

C: Yeah. Yeah! It’s Snap Judgment Presents: Spooked.

K: Okay.

C: So Glynn has a lotta energy—

K: Yes.

C: —and it’s just a lot to take in. And so I generally fast forward through Glynn’s little like—

K: (laughs)

C: —prelude in the beginning cuz (laughing) I’m just like, I can’t deal.

K: Yeah.

C: But then they’ll have stories from all over of people who are just regular people, and some of those stories are literally the scariest things I’ve ever heard in my life, and … I think it’s a really good podcast if you’re into that kind of thing.

K: Hmm.

C: So if you’re not into it, I wouldn’t suggest it. But if you are into like … just, here are stories that are unexplainable—

K: Mm-hmm.

C: —that have happened to everyday people, that are really terrifying and fascinating. Like, utterly fascinating. So I’m into that kinda stuff, I would say.

K: Yeah. The only thing I can think of that I liked that was kinda like that was a TV show—I don’t even think it’s on anymore. This has gotta be a decade, fifteen years ago. (clears throat) A show called A Haunting. Have you ever seen that?

C: I don’t know.

K: Okay. It was like an antho[logy]—not an anthology, but like, every episode—it was the same thing, like you mentioned. Just regular people who were telling the story of like, we lived in this space, or we bought this business, or whatever. We lived in this house or this apartment and all of these things happened. And it was—I think for me, it was not so much the ghosty stuff that I cared about, but I really liked the … it was very low-budge—

C: (laughs) Yeah.

K: —and so I really liked the … just like the—and it was all like, you know, talking heads, the actual person who—people—who experienced it, but then they would have reenactments, you know? So reenact—

C: Oh, I love a reenactment.

K: I love a terrible reenactment. (laughs)

C: I do too!

K: That’s one of the reasons I love the show Deadly Women, cuz I’m just like, it’s so cheesy. It’s so bad, and they often have Australian actors trying to do american accents, and it’s a nightmare.

C: (laughs)

K: And just like, it’s so terrible. But this show is the same, where it was like, you know, they have the reenactments of the experiences. And that’s probably the only ghosty thing that I was very into, but I partially was just into it cuz I’m like, (laughs) this show is so terrible.

C: Right. (laughs)

K:(laughing) It’s so bad. But yeah, I really liked the … I don’t know, I thought it was interesting. Cuz like you were saying, it was regular people. It wasn’t people who do this as a living—for a living—

C: Yeah.

K: —or anything. It was just like, I lived in this house and it terrified me and my family (laughs) the whole time. Like, we were terrorized by something. We don’t know what or why, but it was really awful. So that kinda stuff I do like listening to, or watching, but yeah. I just never was into the like ghost hunt-ier type shows.

C: Yeah.

K: And there are a lot of them! Even freakin Rob Lowe had a ghost hunt—ghost hunter show.

C: Of course he did. And you know … (sighs) here’s something about—

K: Well, he had like his sons, which I think are into it.

C: I’m sorry, what? Oh, his sons?

K: Yeah, his sons I think are into that? And so because their dad is Rob Lowe, they’re like, let’s just make a TV show. And then it happened. (laughs) So I’m like—

C: Yeah. You know, Rob Lowe … people seem to not remember him—

K: I remember—

C: —havin sex with sixteen-year-olds—

K: That’s really weird, how that just kind of like disappeared from public consciousness.

C: Just—nobody cares. Yeah. I don’t wanna see Rob Lowe in anything.

K: I think some people actually care, cuz I remember—there’s this podcast I like called DoughBoys, which I don’t know if you’ve—

C: Mm-hmm.

K: Okay. Yeah, so the premise of the show is two friends, Nick Wiger and Mike Mitchell, they’re like, they just eat fast food—

C: Mm-hmm.

K: —and they kind of review it, but not really. Like they’re just kinda there to shoot the shit and mess around.

C: Yeah.

K: And they have guests on, and so a lotta times they’ll let the guests pick the place they go to. And it’s not always fast food; it’s just like restaurants, you know.

C: Mm-hmm.

K: Usually not anything that’s higher-tier than fast casual. And so they had Rob Lowe on an episode, and like—

C: Mmm!

K: —people got really mad about it (laughs) for the reasons that we just mentioned.

C: Yeah.

K: And they actually pulled the episode and were like, yeah, any of the ad money we got from this episode, we’re donating to RAINN, and all these other places, so I was like, good!

C: Yeah.

K: Good for DoughBoys. Like that made me happy, that they did that. But yeah, it’s very weird how it’s just kinda gotten memory-holed.

C: Mm-hmm.

K: I have to say, I also too for a long time had totally forgot that that happened. And then when he was having his resurgence from Parks & Rec, I was like, oh yeah! That thing that everyone was like kind of mad about for a year and then (laughs) went away.

C: Mm-hmm.

K: Cuz I mean he was like on The West Wing, and like, yeah, Parks & Rec—

C: He’s done well for himself.

K: Yeah, it’s not like it’s holding him back in any way, so.

C: Not at all.

K: I mean, now he has a podcast on Conan O’Brien’s network—

C: Ugh. That makes me sad.

K: —[inaudible] him, I guess. Yeah. But yeah, A Haunting. I definitely—I wonder if you could find it on some weird streaming service or something, because it’s just—it’s so—I used to like falling asleep to it cuz it’s just such a terrible—

C: (laughs)

K: It’s just so bad! I would just be watching it like, I can’t believe they were like, yes, put this wig on that person! Put—you know, move this across, and I’m just like—

C: Oh, yeah! I love a cheap wig.

K: No—you would be in heaven—

C: Yeah.

K: —if you (laughing) watched this show, because it is so bad. Yeah. That’s a fave ghosty thing of mine even though I don’t care about ghosts. I just … the production quality is what I’m there for, so.

C: Yes! Well, okay. Are you ready for Two Cents, No Tax?

K: Oh yeah! So who are we (laughs) … I guess it’s me? Am I doing it?

C: It’s gonna be you!

K: Okay, good! Like ‘N Sync said, it’s gonna be me.

C: I don’t know the song, but yes.

K: You know the meme! It’s gonna be May? It’s from that song.

C: It’s gonna be May.

K: Oh my god, Caitlin. (laughs)

C: (laughs) I …

K: Okay. There’s a meme of Justin Timberlake’s face and he’s like looking into the camera and then it has in the meme, you know, meme generator font, “It’s gonna be May.” Because in the song, that’s how he sings the word “me.”

C: Oh. Okay. (laughs)

K: He says May, and you—I’m a hundred per cent sure you’ve seen the meme, and I’m … I’m pretty sure you’ve heard the song. (laughs)

C: I don’t know if I have, to be honest.

K: Oh, interesting, okay. It’s fine. It’s like, the video’s better than I think the song is, with them as toys—like action figures—

C: Oh!

K: —and then like at the toy store, they come to life, and then the barbies come to life, and then they get bought by—and then when they get scanned, they turn into like the real versions of themselves. and … it’s a whole thing.

C: That—

K: It was back in the 90’s, or early 2000’s, when they’d spend a lot of money to make music videos. (laughs)

C: Right. (laughs)

K: Not like now. (laughs) But yeah, it’s fine. It’s a fine song. I don’t think you need to care that much (laughs) if you haven’t heard it. You’re not missing that much. But the meme, that’s what you need to—

C: Okay. Well, I’m behind on the times. As always.

K: (laughs) Obviously. That song’s like twenty years old. (laughs)

C: I know. (laughs) Okay. So I’m gonna give you a few topics; you’re gonna give me your opinion.

K: Mm-hmm.

C: Okay. The first Two Cents, No Tax I have is jazz.

K: Um—

C: Not Utah Jazz. Classical jazz.

K: (laughs) Yeah. I’m also like, eh, on them too. Uh … I think it’s fine. I think if you like it, great for you. I personally have never been a jazz person. So much so that like, when I was in high school, I was in every band thing because I was obsessed with band. I was like a huge band nerd. And my best friend also, Victoria, she also played trumpet and was also in every band thing. But there was one band thing that she did that I was never gonna do, and that was jazz band. I was like—

C: Oh.

K: —I hate jazz band so much! (laughs) I’ll never do it. Especially because it was like … I don’t know if you guys had this at your school, but we had a thing called zero period, which was before first period. So first period started at 8am, and zero period started at 7:15, and it was all electives. So it was particular electives that you wanted to be in that they—I guess they didn’t have time to do it—I don’t know why they existed the way they did. But you would go … school would start for you at 7:15 and you would have zero period. And jazz band was at zero period. I was like, first of all, I hate jazz band.

C: (laughs)

K: I don’t like the music that they choose. And secondly, I am not gettin to school at 7:15. Like I’m not doin that. (laughs) So I was like never—

C: For jazz. That is so early for jazz.

K: Exactly! Like, no thank you. And I remember one time—I forget who had—couldn’t come to some performance that they were doing, and (laughs) my best friend talked me into it. She’s like, “Just come, like it’ll be fun, you’ll get to”—and I’m like … fine! (laughs) Like, I’ll go.

C: (laughs)

K: And I was so mad that I agreed to do it. (laughs) I hated it so much. I hate their music—

C: (laughs)

K: I just did not like it at all. So I’m like, you know what, if you like jazz, great for you. I generally don’t care that much about it. There are like a couple jazz people that I think are fine, but it’s not a type of music that I’m into or would actively choose (laughs) to listen to most of the time. So—

C: Mkay.

K: Yeah.

C: So that’s gonna be a no from you.

K: Yeah. It also reminds me of … there’s another podcast that I listen to—shoutout to Extra Hot Great—one of the best podcasts in existence, probably only second to ours.

C: Yes.

K: And (laughing) they have a segment called “Is This Worse Than Jazz?”

C: (laughs)

K: —because they all hate jazz. All the hosts hate jazz, and so they’ll pick a thing, a pop culture thing that’s happening, and they’ll be like, “Is this worse than jazz?” (laughs) and then they all have to talk about why they don’t like it so much, and then they come to a consensus about whether or not it is. So yeah, I don’t feel as strongly as they do about jazz—

C: Mm-hmm.

K: —but generally, I’m like, eh. It’s fine.

C: Mkay. I’ll accept that, yeah. Okay. The next one I have is a fashion-related question.

K: Mm. Okay. (laughs)

C: So what do you think of double denim? So like—

K: Okay, so like if—

C: —someone wearing denim on the top and denim on the bottom.

K: Yeah yeah yeah. No, yeah, Canadian tuxedo.

C: (laughing) Is that what it’s called?

K: Oh, yeah! You never heard that? (laughs)

C: God, you’re teaching me so much today!

K: Caitlin, you need to catch up. Yeah, no, your Canadian tuxedo is denim shirt, denim pants.

C: I think that is hysterical! I’ve never heard that. Okay.

K: (laughs) Yeah. It also has other names for like other places’ tuxedos, I think mostly in the South. But yeah, I think it’s fine. I think for me, I wouldn’t do it unless it was like [a] chambray shirt or like any other kind of color of denim. Because I get very … again, I’m not a fashion person, like I really don’t care that much about clothes, but for some reason it irks me when the denims don’t match. You know? I’m like—

C: Oh, not the same color?

K: Yeah, exactly. I’m like, okay, well you can have a light shirt and a dark denim, or the other way around, but don’t try to match them because it’s never gonna be—

C: Right.

K: —a perfect match, and it’s always gonna irk me. But generally speaking, I’m like, it’s fine. It’s a very … I feel like it’s a very middle-aged guy kind of (laughs) fashion choice. I don’t know. It’s a certain kind of demographic that is into it, and I’m not of that demographic. So … but yeah. I think it’s fine, but it’s also kind of a little bit cheesy. But, you know. Do you.

C: I just always think of the Britney and Justin … this is the second time we’re bringing up Justin today.

K: That’s funny. I actually think of Jay Leno. That’s the one—the number one—

C: Oh, god.

K: —that comes to mind. Cuz that’s what he—he wears the same outfit all the time, and it’s that. It’s denim on denim. He never is seen in public in anything different, unless he’s in a suit and he’s performing. It’s very weird. It’s a weird choice. But—

C: It is a weird choice. But he’s a terrible person.

K: Yeah. Apparently he like—yes. He’s not great. (laughs) Apparently he chose that because he was just like, oh, I don’t wanna have to think about clothes, and I can just pick the same thing every day; I don’t have to worry about it.

C: And that’s the choice he made.

K: I guess. It’s very weird, though (laughs), but you do you, Jay Leno.

C: (laughs) Right. And we will judge you for it.

K: Mm-hmm.

C: Okay. The next thing I have is … and this is funny from a disabled woman asking another disabled woman.

K: (laughs) Okay!

C: But (laughs) … why fuckin not? Okay. Skydiving. What do you think about people who go skydiving?

K: Uh … I would never do it. As somebody who has a very pronounced fear of heights, I could not ever see myself skydiving for any reason—

C: Mm.

K: —unless it was absolutely necessary (laughs) to my like … I wouldn’t survive otherwise. But yeah. I don’t—I cannot fathom what makes someone choose to do it. (laughs)

C: Yeah.

K: Like as someone who hates heights, I’m just like, no. I actually—funny that you mentioned the disability thing. I have a friend of mine, Jesse, from college, who is a quadraplegic who loves it.

C: Mm-hmm.

K: He’s done it like a bunch of times. And I’m just like, Jesse. Please (laughs) … like—

C: (laughs) Right.

K: Please don’t! He’s super into it, and I’m just like, why would you?! But I guess he—you know, he likes the rush and stuff like that. I’m like, well good for you, but I would never. Like I just … ugh. Even the idea of it makes my stomach lurch. I can’t … nuh-uh.

C: Yeah.

K: No thank you. What about you? Would you ever?

C: I don’t think so. I mean … one, how am I gonna do it? Like I would have to be strapped to somebody.

K: Yeah. That’s what he—that’s what my friend Jesse does. It’s a tandem.

C: Mm-hmm.

K: So he is with another person who’s like a … I guess an expert skydiver? So yeah. It’s not like he’s doing it alone or anything.

C: There are so many things I would rather do—

K: (laughs) I know. Exactly.

C: —than go skydiving.

K: Especially like … for fun. You know what I mean?

C: Yeah.

K: Like I’m not—that’s not something that I would be like, yes. This is exciting to me. It’s like, no. No. I have … there’s a (laughs) … a long list of things.

C: Yeah. I agree. Okay. What do you think of pumpkin pie?

K: Oh. See, this is … you waded into controversial territory here.

C: Mm. Mm-mm-mm!

K: I mean, for me, none of it is controversial, cuz I don’t really like pumpkin pie. But I also don’t really like sweet potato pie, and so those are like—

C: I was gonna ask you about sweet potato pie too.

K: Yeah. For Black people, it’s mostly sweet potato. I don’t think I’ve ever had a pumpkin pie that was made by a Black person. (laughs)

C: Mm-hmm.

K: So, you know, when it’s holidays for me and my family, it’s always sweet potato pie, which I don’t like. I am not a fan. And I also don’t like pumpkin pie, so I’m like, thumbs down on both of them. But there’s a … a conflict, I think. Whereas pumpkin pie is thought of as the “mainstream” choice and the thing people see around their fall and winter holidays, where like, if you’re Black, you’re never eating pumpkin pie. It’s always—

C: Oh!

K: It’s always sweet potato pie.

C: Is there any kinda pie you really like?

K: I—I like pie a lot. I just don’t really like a—

C: Those two.

K: I don’t like those ones. (laughs) Like I like a—

C: Which ones do you like?

K: I like a fruit pie.

C: Okay.

K: Mostly. And I also like a … like, I like certain cheesecake. Well (laughs) … my grandma makes this no-bake kinda cheesecake—

C: Yeah.

K: —that’s really good. It’s one of my favorite desserts ever. But I generally don’t love cheesecake that much. It’s very … it really depends. I do like a key lime. I like a key lime.

C: I love key lime. Yeah.

K: Yeah. I’ll try pretty much any pie (laughs), but I’m not gonna like all of them. But yeah. If it’s a fruit pie, though, I’m usually in, a hundred per cent.

C: Okay! Well I will not make you sweet potato pie or pumpkin pie.

K: Or pumpkin, thank you. (laughing) I appreciate it.

C: You are welcome. Well, thank you for these thoughtful answers that you’ve given to these questions.

K: Welcome. You’re welcome.

C: So we are going to move on now to what we have been listening to, reading, watching, whatever, this week. I will say, I have been obsessed—this is a food thing.

K: Mm.

C: And this is not something that you will want to try, Krystal—

K: (laughs)

C: —because it is spicy, and I know you’re not into spice.

K: M-hmm. Mm-hmm.

C: I got—and this was actually (laughs) by accident, but I was like, I really wanna get myself some chili oil.

K: Mm. Mm-hmm.

C: And so I went online, and I’m googling “What’s the best chili oil?” And I’m [a] hardcore foodie, like love food; I love reading about it, eating it, thinkin about it …

K: (laughs)

C: Dreaming about it. I’m like, so food-motivated … it’s a little unhealthy. But I was like, I’ve never had chili oil. You know, in my house. I’m sure I’ve had it at restaurants and stuff.

K: Mm-hmm.

C: And so I went online and I ordered this chili oil called—the brand is ZinDrew, which is like a portmanteau, I think, of these two people’s names.

K: Mm.

C: But they made this brand, ZinDrew chili oil, and I got something called the X Batch, and it is like … I think it’s like crunchy garlic chili oil.

K: Mm-hmm.

C: It is fire-red. It stains everything. I tasted it, and I’m like, I can see through time.

K: (laughs)

C: And (laughs) I did not realize. I thought I was buying the milder version. No. I got the extra-hot. So I’ve been eating it on like everything. Every night on … I put it on roasted broccoli, and it was—

K: (laughs)

C: —oh, god. It was so good. I put it on—I mean, literally I’m puttin it on salad; I’m putting it on … I think I had some enchiladas, or—anyway. Everything—

K: You put it on salad?! Caitlin … (laughs)

C: I know. A little bit. Just cuz I really like the crunch.

K: Mm. Mm-hmm.

C: And I like … yeah. I know.

K: (laughs)

C: I kinda made myself sick. I kind of made myself sick. So, I will say though, if you like spicy—

K: Mm.

C: —the ZinDrew chili oil, it is—it really is … it’s dangerous, though. I’m like I need to take a break. Cuz I’m hurting myself physically. (laughs)

K: (laughs)

C: So that was my food thing.

K: Mm.

C: And then I have been listening to the Trixie and Katya’s Bald and the Beautiful podcast on YouTube—

K: Mm-hmm.

C: —which is so funny … oh hey! Look what we have. We have a visitor. Toshio—oh, you can’t see it. We don’t share a screen. Duh, Caitlin.

K: I’m like, what? (laughs) I’m like, what are you talking about?

C: Sorry. (laughs)

K: That’s hilarious.

C: Yeah. Hello?

Toshio: Hi.

K: (laughs)

C: Hey!

T: Sorry.

C: Hello hello! How are you? Toshio has just joined us.

T: I … I’m in Virginia Beach at … never book an ocean view room—

C: Oh no! What’s happening?

T: Cuz it’s different from ocean front.

C: Oh! (laughs)

K: (laughs) Nice.

C: What does ocean view mean?

T: This is ocean view.

C: I’m seeing a lot of concrete.

K: (laughs)

T: So here’s the balcony.

C: Okay. We’re seeing concrete.

T: We got concrete, gray, there’s lots of white, off-white—

C: This is a rooftop we’re looking at, for the listeners.

T: That was a blunt at one point.

C: A blunt on the ground. (laughs)

T: And then so you can see the ocean. It’s true.

K: Yes, in the distance you can.

C: (laughs) Very, very far away.

T: Sorry to interrupt. You were probably like mid-amazing thought.

C: Oh, so amazing. I was just saying how I’ve been listening to Trixie and Katya’s Bald and the Beautiful podcast—

T: Love it.

C: —on YouTube. Yeah, I’ve been just kinda binging that obsessively this week. Cuz we’re all—I needed—I needed a funny pick-me-up this week.

K: Mm.

C: I definitely reached a point this week where I was in just a very depressed state of mind with COVID and the state of the world, so, you know, kind of trying to actively find things that will help. And I have to say, they really do. They … they make me laugh out loud. Very funny. It’s free. It’s on YouTube. It’s silly. I love it. So that’s what I have been into this week.

K: You know what? Actually, it was … it came up on another podcast, and I was like, ooh, I bet Caitlin would really like that. Had you—have you ever listened to the podcast CHAMELEON: Hollywood Con Queen?

C: (gasps) No, but it’s on my list. Oh—

K: Oh, okay. yeah. It’s basically like a mini-series podcast about like this … I mean, I guess I don’t wanna spoil it, but about this woman who had came up with this kind of ingenious con and conned all of these Hollywood people out of like a ton of money, and … it’s very interesting. I was like, Caitlin would (laughs) love this podcast—

C: Yeah.

K: —if she hasn’t listened to it. But it’s basically weird, because she was conning like … I mean, usually, a lotta times when it’s a Hollywood scam, it’s—you know, they’re conning people with lots of money and stuff, but she was conning sort of below-the-line crew people—

C: Right. Crew people!

K: —like gig workers, yeah.

C: I think I did listen to the tiniest, tiniest bit of the podcast, and I was at work and then I had to turn it off, and then I think I forgot. So I will definitely re-up that on my list of things to listen to.

K: It’s like wild. It’s ve[ry]—it’s wild. (laughs) It’s one of those things where you’re like, how did you even come up with this idea? Like sometimes scams are like, okay, obviously. I get why you’re targeting these people and in this way, but this one, I was like, that’s kind of … I mean, not—I don’t wanna give that person props, but like—

C: Right. (laughs)

K: —kind of like, wow, that’s … that took some thinking. But yeah, that’s just sort of—if you need another pick-me-up kinda thing—

C: Always.

K: —I’m like, this would be up Caitlin’s alley, for sure. So I haven’t been watching—again, every week I’m just like, I just watched a buncha Bob’s Burgers—

C: (laughs)

K: —which is mostly what I do. But I did start watching—this—it premiered a couple of months ago at this point, but I was never a Schitt’s Creek person—

C: Mm-hmm.

K: I mean, I obviously am aware that it exists (laughs) and have watched a handful of episodes. But I never got into it and watched the whole thing all the way through. But I did—you know, I feel vaguely warm towards the cast, especially the one person in the main cast who’s not related to Eugene Levy—

C: (laughing) Right.

K: —and isn’t like a comedy legend. So Annie Murphy, who played … oh my gosh, what’s—

C: Alexis.

K: Alexis, thank you. I was like, David and … yeah. Alexis, in Schitt’s Creek—she is in a new show called Kevin Can F**k Himself, which—

C: Yeah, I’ve been really curious about this show.

K: I was too, and it’s basically kind of the opposite of Schitt’s Creek in a lotta ways. So basically she plays a woman who … okay, how do I explain it? So it’s like a … it’s basically like a send-up or a dark satire of the sort of comedy or sitcom trope of like, hot wife, schlubby husband.

C: Mm-hmm.

K: And she plays the hot wife, and her husband is a schlub. And it’s kind of split into two separate perspectives. So there’s one perspective where it basically looks like a sitcom, so it’s very video lighting, very bright, and lots of canned laughter and stuff. But then there’s another split, where it looks sort of like it’s filmed on film, and looks like sort of a gritty TV show, and that’s where you see (laughs) the actual psychological effects of what it would be like to live in a show where you’re constantly—to live in a situation where you’re constantly dealing with the fact that your husband is terrible (laughs) and like—

C: Right.

K: —doesn’t do anything, and kinda low-key hates you.

C: Yeah.

K: And so like, how do you psychologically handle that, and what choices do you make, and … it’s a really interesting premise, and the way that they do it is really cool, I think, the way that it looks. Cuz obviously you go from the multi-cam, with the sitcom stuff, to single cam when she’s behind the scenes, I guess you could call it, even. But yeah, it’s an interesting show. I haven’t—I’ve only seen the first episode. I think—or maybe the first two, because I think the way that they’re … they premiered back to back, so it’s like a two-hour kind of intro. But yeah, it’s very … it’s a very interesting premise, especially because you don’t often get that perspective in sitcoms, or at least in these kinds of sitcoms. Obviously, often, the husband is like the focal point of the show, and very often the wife is kinda orbiting around him—

C: Right.

K: —and she’s doing stuff, and occasionally has her own storylines that they follow. But mostly, it’s usually the husband who’s the main focus, and so it’s interesting to sort of flip that on its head and sort of get the wife’s perspective, not just in the, you know, comedy, but also in the dramatic half of the show. It’s … I think it’s based on—I haven’t read this—too deeply into this to see if it’s actually true, but I think the idea for it came a couple years ago, Kevin James got a new sitcom called Kevin Can Wait—

C: Ugh.

K: —and basically (laughs), they hired this woman to play his wife in the show, and then I guess she wasn’t doing well and the ratings weren’t doing well, so they just unceremoniously killed her off—

C: Oh yeah! I remember reading about that!

K: —and then they got Leah Remini—yeah (laughs). And then they brought in Leah Remini from King of—when they were on The King of Queens together and were like, okay, now you can be his wife in the show now (laughs). And it was kind of like a callback to the original show, and I think they even sprinkle in references to King of Queens in this new show.

C: I’m sure they do.

K: But the woman was kinda like … it was kind of shitty, you know—

C: (laughs) Right.

K: —the fact that they were like, okay, well actually, you’re not good. We’re just gonna bring in his old wife from his old show.

C: Mm-hmm.

K: And it was—and so I think that’s where the idea for this came from, where it was like, oh, she’s got to spend a whole season being the butt of every joke, and all of this stuff, and then they—and then they decided, well actually you’re not even good at that, so, (laughs) you know, here’s this other person that we’re gonna bring in.

C: Wow.

K: But yeah, it’s like a really interesting … it’s a really interesting idea and a[n] interesting premise. I’m … I’m curious to see where it goes at the end of the season, cuz it’s … I think they’re only halfway through right now. (sighs) But yeah, it’s … I don’t know. I just think it’s so cool. Especially cuz it’s very different from what she—

C: Mm-hmm.

K: —(laughs) was doing in Schitt’s Creek. So—

C: Mm-hmm. I love Annie Murphy. I really love Annie Murphy.

K: She’s very good.

C: Yeah.

K: She was good at that character. But she’s also very good at this. Especially the dramatic, you know, half of it. But yeah, that’s pretty much the (laughs) only thing I’ve been watching this week that’s not like … like I said, Bob’s Burgers.

C: Nothing wrong with that!

K: Did I mention I watched Space Jam? I think I did.

C: Yeah, yeah. We talked about Space Jam.

K: Mm-hmm. I watched that. It was fine.

C: Well, Toshio, since we haven’t heard much from you, would you like to say anything that you’ve been listening to or watching or eating?

K: (laughs) He has not been watching the ocean. We know that.

C: Yeah, you’re not watchin the ocean. We know that, yes.

T: Not from this view. Or lack thereof. I’ve been seein some good looks. I will … maybe I’ll post for the Patreon some of the … the best t-shirts—

C: Ooh, yes!

T: —of 2021 Virginia Beach.

K: Oh, man.

T: The Thick-fil-A short shorts that are everywhere—

K: Hmm.

T: —that I am planning on purchasing.

K: Yes.

C: (gasps) Oh my god. And you just texted us a photo that is in the style of Friends—the TV show Friends—

K: (laughing) Oh my god!

C: —and the t-shirt says … holy shit. Okay, the t-shirt says … we’ll post this on our Instagram stories too. “The one where Epstein didn’t kill himself.” Holy shit. Who is gonna buy this t-shirt?

T: (laughs)

K: I mean, a lotta people, honestly. A lotta—

C: Wow!

T: Yeah, a lotta drunk people.

K: Mm-hmm.

C: Yeah.

T: And it’s also—but I guess they thought it’d be popular enough—cuz they’re basically just stickers that they … they print onto the t-shirt—

K: Mm.

C: Oh, yeah.

T: —and they were on demand.

K: Oh. (laughs) So someone (laughs)—

C: (laughs)

K: Oh my god! What a choice. Okay. That’s—yeah—

C: Do you really believe that he killed himself, though? I mean, I don’t.

T: No.

K: I just feel like it’s too convenient. But, again—

C: Like, so many people wanted him dead—

T: I agree. I agree.

K: —I don’t wanna be a conspiracy theorist. But yeah. It just feels too … but also too, I could see a world in which he’s like, I don’t wanna bother with whatever’s gonna come after this, you know? Whether it be a trial, or prison—which would probably—is what would have happened. (laughs) So I …. I could see both things, potentially being true. Or, you know, either thing potentially being true.

T: Right.

K: But yeah, it just felt too convenient.

C: Yeah.

T: A little too convenient.

C: Yeah. And my mom isn’t convinced he’s actually dead.

K: (laughs) Oh, my god. Okay.

T: Ooh!

C: She thinks that … cuz she’s like—

T: What about JFK Jr.?

K: Oh no! (laughs)

C: Oh, god. He … not—you know, everyone—well. He—not only did JFK Jr. kill himself, he killed that poor Carolyn and—

K: Well, I mean, it wasn’t like suicide. He wasn’t trying to kill himself.

C: It—no, he straight-up murdered everyone because he’s like, I’m a rich guy and I’m gonna go fly a plane—

K: (laughs) Yeah, exactly. He wasn’t intending to kill everyone.

C: No, but that’s what white privilege and narcissism will get you.

K: (laughs) Okay. We don’t have to go there. (laughs)

C & T: (laugh)

K: I feel like a low-key kind of sympathy towards that family just for—I don’t know why. Probably cuz I worked at the JFK Library for like a semester, and I’m like, man, they went through a lot. (laughs) I don’t know. But they’re like—

C: They did, but—

K: —too rich. Too rich for me.

C: I … agree to disagree, I guess, about sympathy for JFK Jr.

K: I—why not? (laughing) He died in a plane crash! What else can you—I feel like—

C: A very preventable one, though.

K: Yeah, but anytime you go up in a plane, you don’t know if you’re gonna live. Like … it’s true for everybody. It just was his time, unfortunately.

T: He was addicted to private jets.

C: (laughs)

K: (laughs) Yeah, but it wasn’t even like a private jet, right? Wasn’t it just like a passenger—

C: I’m sure it was, yeah. He’s like, I’m gonna go fly this. I do not have the confidence or the capabilities, but I’m rich.

K: Did he not? Or was he just new to it? Cuz I think he did. Wasn’t he licensed? This is not even—(laughing) this is not going in the episode.

T: I believe Krystal. I believe Krystal because she—

K: I think he did have a license; I think it was just one of those things that just happens sometimes. Yeah.

C: I can’t believe we’re talking about this.

T: This is getting heated!

K: I just (laughs)—

C: It is!

K: I—like I said, I feel like it’s—I feel like it would—I would feel equally sad if he was driving and they’d all died. Like to me, it’s the same—

C: Mm.

K: —kind of a thing. You know?

C: Yeah.

K: Obviously it’s more likely if you’re driving than if you’re flying a plane—

C: Right.

K: —but like I said, that family—I just felt like even though they had a lotta money, I’m like, this is what you kind of … not get, but like … it feels like it was the opposite—the universe trying to (laughs) correct for some of the benefits that they’d given them, of like, oh, also all these really terrible things are gonna happen (laughs) to you as well.

C: Well, on that note, this has been a weird episode. (laughs)

K: Yeah, how’d we get there? (laughs)

C: This has been so random.

K: That—I hope none of this is in the podcast. (laughs) But yeah, Kevin Can F[**k] Himself. That’s a good show. I think you should watch it.

C: Kevin Can—okay. So Kevin Can F[**k] Himself, yes. Trixie and Katya, Bald and the Beautiful podcast on YouTube—


T: Thick-Fil-A.

C: What did you say?

K: (laughs)

T: Thick-fil-A.

C: Thick-fil-A?

K: Thick-fil-A. (laughs)

C: Love it.

K: The shorts. Gonna get those shorts.

C: Mm-hmm.

K: Also that CHAMELEON podcast.

C: Oh, yeah! Thank you. I need to check that out.

K: Yeah. It’s very good.

T: Did y’all watch [The] White Lotus yet?

C: No, I haven’t seen it yet.

T: It’s pretty good. Yeah.

K: Is it—okay, so is it like a comedy? Or is it a comedy-drama—

T: Yeah. It’s like a dark—it sounds a bit like the Kevin Can [Kill] Himself …

K: Mm-hmm.

T: —it’s like a dark comedy.

K: Okay.

T: And Jennifer Coolidge plays Jennifer Coolidge.

K: Yeah. (laughs)

T: Like she does.

C: Love it, yeah.

K: I could see that, yeah.

T: And I like it so far.

K: Okay. Why is—promoted, when I saw the commercials for it, like it made it seem like a—like there’s some kinda mystery or something, but I’m like no, it’s just rich people being …

T: It starts out with one of the people—I’m not spoilin—comin back and sayin … I think there was a murder.

K: Oh, okay! So there is something like that.

T: Yeah.

K: Oh, okay. Cool.

T: So, but we don’t know who, why, where, what.

C: Oh! Okay.

K: I really wanna watch that, actually.

T: Yeah.

K: Cuz that guy J … I can’t remember his name. It’s like Jake or John or J … Jeff—

C: Mike White?

K: No, the—one of the actors. He was the same guy—

C: Oh.

K: —if you ever saw the movie Obvious Child, that Jenny Slate movie—

C: Yeah.

K: I loved that movie so much.

C: It was a good movie.

K: It’s really good! I think people should check it out. Another one I’m watching from like a decade ago. But the guy who played the guy in the movie that she, you know, sleeps with, he is in the show.

C: The—one of the Duplass brothers?

K: No. No. He’s not a Duplass. He’s—ugh, what is his name? His name is Jake Lacy. Ugh. That was gonna drive me crazy. Yeah. His name is Jake Lacy. I don’t know. I feel so much warmth from him. Anytime I see him in anything else, I’m like, aww, from Obvious Child! He was so (laughing) good in that movie!

C: Oh right! Okay. I just looked him up.

K: Mm-hmm.

C: Yeah, he’s go that like sweet kind of face—

K: Oh, yes! He was the husband in Carol. That’s another place. He was the—the bad husband in Carol. I mean, they’re both bad husbands. (laughs)

C: You know what? I’ve never seen Carol.

K: Oh, you haven’t seen Carol? I think you would like it.

C: I haven’t seen Carol. I know, I feel like I should, but I haven’t seen it.

K: I think it’s good.

C: I have like a—

K: I—I just like—basically, to me (laughs), if you’ve ever seen [The] Talented Mr. Ripley, in my mind, my canon is that it’s the same character that Cate Blanchett plays in Talented Mr. Ripley. She’s just (laughs) older, and a lesbian now (laughs). Which she’s not in Talented Mr. Ripley.

C: Tosh—yeah. Toshio just said I don’t support other women. In the chat. It’s true.

K: Yeah, Caitlin. How dare you?

C: I know.

K: A special place in hell, etc.

C: Yeah. (laughs) Me and Ted Kennedy. See ya there.

K: (laughs) He’s—I mean, not to speak ill of the dead, but he’s probably there, so—

C: Oh, he’s definitely there.

K: I mean, yeah. For his car accident stuff alone. But—

C: Right.

T: Ooh! We should do an episode on celebrity car accidents that got swept under the rug!

C: (laughs)

K: Oh my gosh, there’d be so many! Matthew Broderick! Brandy! Caitlyn Jenner!

C: Oh, god. Brandy! Jesus.

K: This guy!

C: Rebecca Gayheart?

K: Yes! Her too! I totally forgot about that.

C: We’re getting dark. We’re getting into really dark territory here.

K: (laughs)

T: So Left Eye? I’m putting Left Eye into this column—

K: Yeah, but Left Eye—I mean, true. True.

T: —but we need to … yeah. We’d need to suss that out.

C: Okay.

K: Mm-hmm. We’re not doing that. That’s so bad.

C: This is the most … this got—this one was dark. This episode.

K: (laughing) Yeah it was. I mean, it kinda made sense. I was talkin about Kevin Can F[**k] Himself and then we just went there. So, you know. Yeah. That’s my … what I’m watching this week.

C: Toshio just asked a good question, How can we end on a light note? I really have no idea. But whatever, we’re all gonna be fine. So everything’s gonna be fine.

K: Yeah, I was gonna say. That’s how we’ll end, on our … on our classic catchphrase.

C: (laughing) Yeah.

K: Everything’s gonna be fine. (laughs) Ahh … yeah.

C: (laughs)

K: I was actually thinking about Space Jam. The thing we can end on that’s nice. The little boy in Space Jam, I’ve been thinking about him all week. He’s just such—

C: Aww!

K: —a little precious little baby. He’s adorable. I don’t—I’ve never seen him in anything else, but I’m like, I hope you have a really good career! Cuz he was so cute!

C: (laughs)

K: And good in this movie across from LeBron, who was like, doin his best.

C: (laughs)

K: (laughs) But … yeah. That’s how we’ll end. Yeah.

C: Okay. I don’t know what the baby looks like but I’m just imagining a real cute kid.

K: He’s just like—yeah, like a lil twelve-year-old kid with like … he’s kinda chubby-cheeked—

C: Aww.

K: —and has a really cute haircut, and I’m like, aww.

C: We’ll just think about this baby.

K: Yeah, exactly. And think about him having a good career in Hollywood.

C: Alright, I’m sendin that energy out.

K: Or not. I mean (laughs)—yeah.

C: Well, as always, you can follow us on Twitter and Instagram at @TwoCentsPlusTax. You can also support our Patreon at @TwoCentsPlusTax.

K: Yeah! I think we’re still taking questions? If you wanna ask us questions. (laughs) I mean, generally if you wanna suggest topics, like any … any of those kinds of things, you can always do that. You know, via our social media channels, or—yeah, our email—TwoCentsPlusTaxPodcast—

C: Right! At gmail[.com].

K: —at gmail.com.

C: Okay.

K: Yeah!

C: Well, thank you for this fascinating episode.

K: Yeah. Everyone, stay safe. If you have a ghost story—

C: (gasps)

K: —obviously, we wanna hear it.

C: Yes. Send em in. I always wanna hear. Always.

K: Well, Caitlin wants to hear it. I don’t—

C: I wanna hear it! Krystal could not care less.

K: I will nod politely. (laughs) Yes.

C: (laughs)

K: Mm-hmm.

C: Alright. Bye!

K: Bye, everyone!

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